News 2/16/22

7 responses

  1. IANAL
    February 15, 2022

    Mm yes, project managers! Everybody likes getting medical treatment from them.

  2. Art_Vandelay
    February 15, 2022

    @IANAL – is it care from project managers or everyone operating at “top of license” (with some actual agreement as to what that means)? For many work-ups, I believe the technology exists to aid those operating at top of license, as to when, they should tap-out if they are feeling a little bit of “diagnostic bravado” (aka, I got this!). That is an interesting comment from an astute “straddler.” An organization with gargantuan market cap, could make an investment to put the appropriate guardrails in place to help evaluate scenarios and keep patients and care delivery frontlines out of peril. Is it also an opportunity for some high-profile companies, that are under U.S. and other government (EU?) scrutiny, to invest a bit in a GPT-3 like toolset that can sit over this type of business model? I guess it comes down to the modern age-old argument – is healthcare a human right? Can some of the tech behemoths gain some extra breathing room while identifying a comfy unique win-win (non Skynet) niche in a partial open source collaboration?

    • IANAL
      February 16, 2022

      I’m not sure I totally understand what that would look like. Here’s why I don’t think

      Primary care doctors at their best do some things large organizations aided by computers will never do. It’s important to remember patients and doctors are people, not protocols, data, algorithms, or conditions.
      A doctor talks to a lot of people, and they talk to you the patient. You as a person give off many many subtle signals that are impossible to recognize out of context. Voice tempo, pitch and volume, body language, subtext, stutter- these are an abbreviated lists of things a human doctor notices without even noticing they notice. The doctor interprets those using their medical knowledge, the knowledge of the human geography of who comes into their practice, their knowledge of medical and organizational processes. They have a tight feedback loop where they quickly decide what to say, to ask another question, whether the patient and provider have the same understanding. This is all stuff that comes naturally to people having conversations. It’s also impossible to record, it’s impossible to analyze out of context, and impossible to make effective process for. I mean Siri can’t even recognize my mothers accent. Transcription is the absolute easiest part of recording, analyzing and interpreting. And the most well resourced technology company fails at it with roughly half of my mothers speech.
      Another aspect of doctors and patients actually being people is that they have a particular social context from which medicine arises. I’ve told my dad he has sleep apnea 100 different ways 100 different times. Anybody who listens to him sleep for 5 minutes could diagnose him. But I’m his kid and he doesn’t take medical advice from his kid. I’m the same way, in that I don’t take medical advice from corporate bureaucracies. That’s partly what I mean by project managers, they don’t know because they don’t do. You can’t protocol your way into people respecting you.
      Economics and politics will allow a shrinking number of upper class people to have access to quality primary care. Large scale bureaucracy will deliver substandard medicine as a loss leader to government payers and whatever is left of the middle class. The underclass that doesn’t have access to government support will do without and pursue alternatives.

      • TH
        February 16, 2022

        I see this argument sometimes in conversations about primary care. Primary care could be all of those things. Everyone would love to have a PCP who knows them really well, who subconsciously analyzes the timber of their voice and then collaboratively constructs a personalized care plan just for them. That would lead to objectively better health outcomes.

        But that is not the current state of primary care in this country. Schedules are packed and frequently run late. Even folks who have PCPs rarely see them. If my child is ill and I want to get them seen – my PCP’s next open appointment is 2 weeks away, but there is an appointment with a PA who works in the same clinic. We’ve never seen that PA before and we’ll never see them again. The PA definitely doesn’t have time to review the medical history in the chart before the appointment.

        The time spent with patients in an office visit is measured in seconds. Providers are rarely using their relationship to or conversation with the patient in their medical decision making. It’s all about their existing protocols for how to deal with a specific complaint.

        The prediction that you end your comment with isn’t wrong… it’s already happened.

      • IANAL
        February 16, 2022

        Yeah In my mind that trend started in the late 80s and has been steadily progressing; it wont have finished running its course for another 10 or 20 years. Not a very interesting prediction, but more likely to be right than the chatbots will save us.
        And yeah, what you get I wouldn’t call primary care, I would call it episodic care if you’ve been to the place before, or urgent care if you haven’t. There are still people who get primary care like what I outlined though; the ones that I know have household incomes that are somewhere between 5 and 10 times the median national income. Not enough for concierge but their kids don’t get those five minute appointments the rest of us get.

  3. Johnnysmooth
    February 16, 2022

    While I have a lot of respect for Sachin, he is wrong on this one. Big tech enters healthcare for any number of reasons but primarily to sell what they already have built. In Apple’s case, it’s all about selling more watches. For Amazon, it’s primarily about expanding consumer reach/sales. As for Amazon Care, look at model for AWS. They had tons of servers sitting idle after holiday rush and decided to leverage those unused servers into a ubiquitous cloud platform ala AWS. Same might play out for Amazon Care. They already have plenty of employees widely distributed across country. They, like all employers are trying to control healthcare spend so they set up a service for employees and now are rolling out to broader market.

    It’s not Big Techs job to “fix” healthcare, it is their job to serve their investors.

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