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	<title>Comments on: HITlaw 3/9/10</title>
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	<description>Healthcare IT News and Opinion</description>
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		<title>By: HITlaw - Bill O'Toole</title>
		<link>http://histalk2.com/2010/03/08/hitlaw-3910/comment-page-1/#comment-8259</link>
		<dc:creator>HITlaw - Bill O'Toole</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Mar 2010 21:24:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://histalk2.com/?p=4702#comment-8259</guid>
		<description>A heartfelt thank you to all who appreciated my work on this HITlaw posting.

To &quot;Always Curious&quot; - depends on the NCA. If it was tailored for development only then arguably ok to move to finance, but if it was a straight &quot;no competitors&quot; then not so ok.

To &quot;LawyerGal&quot; Your statement that NO court has ever upheld a non-compete longer than one year is not accurate.  One good example would be Philips Electronics North America Corp. v. Hope, 631 F. Supp. 2d 705 (M.D.N.C. 2009), in which the court not only upheld a two year restricted period, but it also extended the term by another 11 months due to a tolling provision in the NCA, whereby the period of restriction was tolled (extended) to match the period of time when the employee was working for a competitor in violation of the agreement.  More recently, a court upheld an 18-month restriction period, which it enforced from the date of summary judgment, not from the date employment ended.  The court in TEKsystems, Inc. v. Bolton, 2010 U.S. Dist. LEXIS 9651 (D. Md. Feb. 4, 2010) permitted an &quot;equitable extension&quot; of the restricted period, even though the NCA lacked such a provision.  I used these two examples to demonstrate that restricted periods in NCAs of more than a year are upheld, and that extensions beyond the already more than one-year terms are also granted.  Please understand that I make these comments not to put down LawyerGal but out of concern for all the readers of these comments.

Again, thanks to all for reading.  LawyerGal, feel free to contact me at my office if you wish to discuss.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A heartfelt thank you to all who appreciated my work on this HITlaw posting.</p>
<p>To &#8220;Always Curious&#8221; &#8211; depends on the NCA. If it was tailored for development only then arguably ok to move to finance, but if it was a straight &#8220;no competitors&#8221; then not so ok.</p>
<p>To &#8220;LawyerGal&#8221; Your statement that NO court has ever upheld a non-compete longer than one year is not accurate.  One good example would be Philips Electronics North America Corp. v. Hope, 631 F. Supp. 2d 705 (M.D.N.C. 2009), in which the court not only upheld a two year restricted period, but it also extended the term by another 11 months due to a tolling provision in the NCA, whereby the period of restriction was tolled (extended) to match the period of time when the employee was working for a competitor in violation of the agreement.  More recently, a court upheld an 18-month restriction period, which it enforced from the date of summary judgment, not from the date employment ended.  The court in TEKsystems, Inc. v. Bolton, 2010 U.S. Dist. LEXIS 9651 (D. Md. Feb. 4, 2010) permitted an &#8220;equitable extension&#8221; of the restricted period, even though the NCA lacked such a provision.  I used these two examples to demonstrate that restricted periods in NCAs of more than a year are upheld, and that extensions beyond the already more than one-year terms are also granted.  Please understand that I make these comments not to put down LawyerGal but out of concern for all the readers of these comments.</p>
<p>Again, thanks to all for reading.  LawyerGal, feel free to contact me at my office if you wish to discuss.</p>
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		<title>By: curious george</title>
		<link>http://histalk2.com/2010/03/08/hitlaw-3910/comment-page-1/#comment-8256</link>
		<dc:creator>curious george</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Mar 2010 04:51:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://histalk2.com/?p=4702#comment-8256</guid>
		<description>I once worked at a company who made the NCA/ND a &quot;material condition for my employement or continued employment&quot;.  This wasn&#039;t just to the newbies; but, to employees that had been there for years and had never been required to sign one.  It was phrased in such a way that we had no choice to sign because keeping our job was dependant upon signature; yet, so sweetly phrased that if reviewed in court it would appear that we &quot;appreciated and agreed that we shouldn&#039;t be allowed to work&quot;.  When pushed, I finally submitted mine with a note that it was required by corporate, when I really wanted to say it was required under duress.  

What about right to work states?  Where do those fall in all of this? Several states were mentioned; but, the term &quot;right to work&quot; wasn&#039;t applied.  For sales reps - most can&#039;t afford to take a year off - although as bad a year as it was for many, we might make more on unemployment. 

The definition of territory is another issue.  If you&#039;ve covered the entire US in a special role or your home state in which you live in another role; how, can the &quot;mason-dixon&quot; line be drawn?  It certainly is vague in most NCD&#039;s that I&#039;ve seen. The Epic references above where competitors are spelled out is a new one for me.

To play devil&#039;s advocate - why is it wrong to solicit clients, some of whom you&#039;ve established relationships built on trust over years?  If you&#039;ve left a company because you don&#039;t believe their product or standards are good - are we not doing our clients a disservice by not continuing a relationship of trust with them?  I think there is no clear answer on that because there are some sales reps that would sell their mother swamp land just to make quota; but, there are many who are ethical and really want their clients to have the best of what the industry can offer. In this industry - we are going to interact with some of the same clients in various ways whether intentionally or not at some point in time.  

I am going to go out on the ledge and &quot;assume&quot; that some HIT  corporations don&#039;t pursue these small sales reps deals in many cases because there may be inhouse dirty laundry that the injured employee could reveal to the public (that has nothing to do with trade secrets) that it&#039;s worth much more to ignore the sales rep or other employee than to have corporate dirty laundry aired...assuming there is some.  While that may seem like playing dirty, by fighting back - how can you feed your family, if you&#039;re not allowed to work in an industry that you&#039;ve spent 10-20 years in?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I once worked at a company who made the NCA/ND a &#8220;material condition for my employement or continued employment&#8221;.  This wasn&#8217;t just to the newbies; but, to employees that had been there for years and had never been required to sign one.  It was phrased in such a way that we had no choice to sign because keeping our job was dependant upon signature; yet, so sweetly phrased that if reviewed in court it would appear that we &#8220;appreciated and agreed that we shouldn&#8217;t be allowed to work&#8221;.  When pushed, I finally submitted mine with a note that it was required by corporate, when I really wanted to say it was required under duress.  </p>
<p>What about right to work states?  Where do those fall in all of this? Several states were mentioned; but, the term &#8220;right to work&#8221; wasn&#8217;t applied.  For sales reps &#8211; most can&#8217;t afford to take a year off &#8211; although as bad a year as it was for many, we might make more on unemployment. </p>
<p>The definition of territory is another issue.  If you&#8217;ve covered the entire US in a special role or your home state in which you live in another role; how, can the &#8220;mason-dixon&#8221; line be drawn?  It certainly is vague in most NCD&#8217;s that I&#8217;ve seen. The Epic references above where competitors are spelled out is a new one for me.</p>
<p>To play devil&#8217;s advocate &#8211; why is it wrong to solicit clients, some of whom you&#8217;ve established relationships built on trust over years?  If you&#8217;ve left a company because you don&#8217;t believe their product or standards are good &#8211; are we not doing our clients a disservice by not continuing a relationship of trust with them?  I think there is no clear answer on that because there are some sales reps that would sell their mother swamp land just to make quota; but, there are many who are ethical and really want their clients to have the best of what the industry can offer. In this industry &#8211; we are going to interact with some of the same clients in various ways whether intentionally or not at some point in time.  </p>
<p>I am going to go out on the ledge and &#8220;assume&#8221; that some HIT  corporations don&#8217;t pursue these small sales reps deals in many cases because there may be inhouse dirty laundry that the injured employee could reveal to the public (that has nothing to do with trade secrets) that it&#8217;s worth much more to ignore the sales rep or other employee than to have corporate dirty laundry aired&#8230;assuming there is some.  While that may seem like playing dirty, by fighting back &#8211; how can you feed your family, if you&#8217;re not allowed to work in an industry that you&#8217;ve spent 10-20 years in?</p>
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		<title>By: EHR Geek</title>
		<link>http://histalk2.com/2010/03/08/hitlaw-3910/comment-page-1/#comment-8251</link>
		<dc:creator>EHR Geek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Mar 2010 23:41:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://histalk2.com/?p=4702#comment-8251</guid>
		<description>This is the most informative article I&#039;ve ever read on the subject (including all the comments!)  Mr. O&#039;Toole&#039;s comments about using the NCA just to limit competition are right on!  Thank you for this invaluable information.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is the most informative article I&#8217;ve ever read on the subject (including all the comments!)  Mr. O&#8217;Toole&#8217;s comments about using the NCA just to limit competition are right on!  Thank you for this invaluable information.</p>
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		<title>By: LawyerGal</title>
		<link>http://histalk2.com/2010/03/08/hitlaw-3910/comment-page-1/#comment-8247</link>
		<dc:creator>LawyerGal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Mar 2010 14:42:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://histalk2.com/?p=4702#comment-8247</guid>
		<description>A good start but a few points to remember:

Each state treatst these differently. For example, McKesson lost a huge legal battle in California on a non-compete. California treated their non-competes as threatening. Meaning, McKesson got in trouble for asking people to sign them.

Another point is NO court has ever upheld a non-compete longer than one year. So if your non-compete says two years, just laugh.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A good start but a few points to remember:</p>
<p>Each state treatst these differently. For example, McKesson lost a huge legal battle in California on a non-compete. California treated their non-competes as threatening. Meaning, McKesson got in trouble for asking people to sign them.</p>
<p>Another point is NO court has ever upheld a non-compete longer than one year. So if your non-compete says two years, just laugh.</p>
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		<title>By: crazy thought</title>
		<link>http://histalk2.com/2010/03/08/hitlaw-3910/comment-page-1/#comment-8246</link>
		<dc:creator>crazy thought</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Mar 2010 14:31:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://histalk2.com/?p=4702#comment-8246</guid>
		<description>Maybe if a company has such a long reaching policy in denying people where they can work maybe they should balance it out with helping employees/ex-employees find where they can work?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maybe if a company has such a long reaching policy in denying people where they can work maybe they should balance it out with helping employees/ex-employees find where they can work?</p>
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